From britdisc-owner@csv.warwick.ac.uk Fri May 28 02:04:35 1999 Received: by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) id CAA27176 for britdisc-outgoing; Fri, 28 May 1999 02:02:42 +0100 (BST) Received: from daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (daffodil [137.205.192.30]) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA27171 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Fri, 28 May 1999 02:02:40 +0100 (BST) Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id CAA24037 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Fri, 28 May 1999 02:02:40 +0100 (BST) Received: from [158.152.248.177] (helo=phidelta.demon.co.uk) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 10nB2k-0005Bc-0A for britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk; Fri, 28 May 1999 01:02:39 +0000 Message-ID: <nN$09FAppeT3Ew5n@phidelta.demon.co.uk> Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 01:59:21 +0100 To: britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk From: Wayne Retter <postmaster@phidelta.demon.co.uk> Reply-To: Wayne Retter <wayne@phidelta.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Drugs and draconian measures References: <000001bea85f$286acd00$5e4b95c1@default> In-Reply-To: <000001bea85f$286acd00$5e4b95c1@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S <pjZRgFWDsQK5ViyP$l4rxVrb6a> Sender: owner-britdisc@warwick.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Time to drop in my (first?) two-penneth... Matthew Lowe <Matthew.Lowe@dial.pipex.com> writes >The problem with making comparisons with other sports is this. Manchester >UTD are a big team and have sponsorship but are not affected by such team >names as "Flaming Arseholes". MU, as a team, are not directly affected, but Football, as a Serious Sport, is. Luckily the "Football" as a generic sport (i.e. from kicking around in the park with your mates, up to World Cup teams) is large enough to dilute or localise any disruption potentially caused. Famous football "stars" making getting rowdy in bars, or on aeroplanes, or saying the wrong things, also has a disruptive effect on the sport - but this gets localised by the use of "it's 'cos it's HIM, not 'cos he's a footballer" > This is because "Flaming Arseholes" are >unheard of and teams like them represent a very small percentage of the >millions of football teams worldwide. But, they (probably) have a ground, get regular (paying?) spectators, and a small sponsorship deal... Not even the sensibly named, currently serious Ultimate teams have that. > When possible sponsores look at ultimate they see a lot higher percentage >of the teams with drug related names. OK, there's comparatively more "unsavoury" names in Ultimate - and it has a lot to do with the size of the sport, and the largely student origins (e.g. "Fingers 6 Steps Ahead of our Minds" is a damn site less enthralling than "Manchester Metropolitan University Ultimate") BUT - student teams seem (by the current state of things) more likely to get sponsorship from local businesses who are more interested in getting said students to use their services/products (mostly pubs!) and advertise them, than being overly concerned about the name said student team goes by Other teams with the more "unsavoury" names, aren't necessarily too fussed about potential sponsorship. The teams that might benefit most from "big", "corporate" deals (like having the TDK or Panasonic logos all over your sponsor-provided kit, and a bit of cash to help with training / transport / tournament / medical fees, and a paid publicity department that can pull strings in the media world) are the "most successful" - i.e. the ones going to Worlds. Some of them have "bizarre" names, but none of them are particularly "unsavoury". If the sponsors aren't too happy with their name, they'll probably not be too fussed about changing it a bit. > Many people have said if teams want sponsorship then another teams name >will not affect that decision, but with ultimate at the stage that it is >sponsors do not look at selling the teams but the sport. >Teams don't contain >big names like Beckham or Owen, Both famous because they're good at their chosen sport. Eddie-the-Eagle was famous for being a nutter - but he had to use the publicity already generated by skijumping to become a famous nutter rather than a nutter no-one has ever heard of! Once Ultimate gets publicity, it will introduce new stars/nutters to the World: Moonee; Parinella; "Corky"; and our own, home-grown: Jackson; Golby; and the Funky 'Did someone say layout?' Monks. Who are the famous people in women's lacrosse? Which team won the World Aerobics Championships? and these sports are televised!!!! surely we could be televised nobodies, too? It's got to be a better source of funds than being nobodies hidden from view, and there's the chance that someone will say "I like this! Call them..." > so the image of the sport is what they use >instead. Any connection between ultimate and drugs will slow the growth of >the game. Just as the association of alcohol with Football, Rugby and Hockey have slowed that growth??? Carling even suggest (tongue-in-cheek) that the game started by kicking a beer can around! Sorry. Point taken - alcohol is a "legalised" drug, as are nicotine, caffeine and the assorted bits in Red Bull (unless you're competing in the Olympics, etc... but that's a matter for Chris Hughes to enlighten you on), but cannabis, etc ISN'T. Whilst I'd be positively scared to use a bunch of drunken Druids as promotional material, in the eyes of the law, it seems to a better sight than a large joint being passed around on a sunny day... The latter may seem more peaceful - but is ILLEGAL. End of story. End of sponsorship. End of fame. Bugger! I reckon we don't have to be squeaky-clean (that has to be near- impossible for anyone!), so a few "unsavoury" names will survive, but if the sponsorship / publicity is available, teams will evolve to their compromise points, to make as much use of what's available without loosing what's really important to them. The sport of Ultimate will, too, but exactly where the compromise point is remains to be seen. I guess we'll find out, when the option arises. Apologies for how long this took. Wayne ---------------------------------------------------------------- Wayne Retter at home: 0181-663-4856 wayne@phidelta.demon.co.uk mobile: 07970-903420 at work: 01737-273611 wayne_retter@watsonwyatt.co.uk