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From: "Ben Ravilious" <bravil@webleicester.co.uk>
To: "BRITDISC" <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: Ultimate growth
Date: Wed, 9 Jun 1999 18:43:44 +0100
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Chris,

Thanks for your email. Your points addressed:

1. Who is this 'management style' letting down?

Its letting down the Juniors, Women and Open teams who do not have the
benefits of freshers fairs, university funding, university facilities, time
to organise stuff, and a nearby bunch of mates to go play ultimate with.

2.Why is there a connection being made between the way the BUF is structured
and its ability to pay salaries?

Because by charging individuals (and yes, that means players paying a bit
more than before) we can get a reliable income with which to employ someone.

3. similarly, is it not possible to keep a database of players and keep in
contact with them without changing to individual membership?

No! Hands up all those willing to maintain a database of 2000 people. It
took me many weeks just to get our team contact database up to date.

4.What do players actually *want* from the BUF (or whatever it might
become)?

I accept that the proposal lacked a clear enough list of benefits for
players - something for version 2 - promise! Suggestions as to what people
would like from the organisation would be welcomed. I see the benefits
falling into two categories: Tangible: Newsletter,discounts on equipment,
discs, insurance, etc, Intangible: Publicity, increased recruitment,
development of the sport. A lot of people want to have the intangible
benefits but most don't have the time to make them happen - fair enough -
with an administrator these people can "put their money where their mouth
is."

5.The cost of maintaining the information base and publishing it (using
emails and
www to keep it low?) is perhaps where our money should go.

Thats where it would go - the newsletter being the single most expensive
proposed benefit of membership. And if you think Internet is sufficient to
keep in contact with everyone then you're probably not fussed about whether
we keep new teams, schools and publicity contacts informed.

6. If you fancy playing for a team at a tournament, would there really be
anything stopping you from doing so?

At Ross-on-Wye - No, Thats not an official BUF Event
At the Nationals/Tour events - Yes, (Chris Hughes would be stopping you!!!)
Rosters are already a requirement, policed membership would only be a small
step further - every other country does it!

7. Are we not at risk of introducing more complication if there is a
different
>administration style for junior/student teams to that for other teams

Probably true - In fact the students who responded didn't seem too concerned
about having autonomy and most just wanted to remain part of the main
organisation. On the other hand, judging by your posting (I assume from your
...ac.uk email address you are a student) some students would prefer to
retain the current set-up, therefore *maybe* students should be running
their own affairs? I'm not a fan of partition myself and I can't see us
telling students they're not welcome at Association events!

8. what if you're a (cliched) 'poor student' and you want to play for an
open team?

Doesn't matter what team you play for. You pay your association membership
(we have proposed a cheaper unwaged/student rate) and you play for whoever
you like.

9. Finally, with regard to paying fees, isn't it logical that you pay
according to
how much involvement you have. Some players may only play in say two/three
tournaments a year. Would £25 for this (and the newsletter telling them
about
tournaments they didn't go to) appeal?

Maybe. Or look at it another way: Many? players don't get to hear
about tournaments because they don't have Internet or their team contact is
lazy, would £25 to be kept informed be too much? Might not regular
communication actually encourage participation? Alternatively, we *could*
charge a fee each time a non-member attends a tournament - but this sounds
like tournament tax which I think most would like to see abolished? You
decide!

10. Here's a suggestion: the BUF runs the info service, and represents
Ultimate to
outsiders. Players wanting to be registered pay a nominal charge. This
service
should be well-advertised to students who have played at uni and are moving
on...
...and if you don't believe it can be done for a nominal fee, then check out
the
sixdegrees website (www.sixdegrees.com) for an example of free information
exchange...its reliant on advertising and the input of its members (it even
has
an Ultimate discussion group). Just think what companies might want to
advertise
to young, athletic graduates.
A newsletter could be published online if popular enough...find a friend
with a
printer for hard copies.

"Let them eat cake", frankly! Who is going to run the info service? Who is
going to deal with registration/charges? Who is going to approach these
companies? Who is going to publish an online newsletter? Are you
volunteering?

We've been here a thousand times before - you simply can't expect people to
give up that much free time - that is why we haven't had Ultimatum for over
a year, that is why the website is out of date, that is why we haven't kept
the school teams and THIS is why we must pay someone to do the boring stuff.

Keep talking....the more feedback the better. Remember nobody has decided
anything yet. This is still just a proposal.


Cheers

Ben

PS, Chris, I have a couple of contacts in Newcastle for you which I will
email to
you separately.


-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Gibbs <chris.gibbs@sunderland.ac.uk>